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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 2/8/2009
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I am only glad if it came up this way to you, Andre!
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 2/7/2009
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Hi Nick,
Wow!
Not just "Blabla" on Sunday. But, a valiant attempt to write down and explain some of the things that intrigue and keep us interested in the craft and art of photography.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 2/1/2009
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I think that this second component of the "lucky accidents" but also of the unsuccesful attempts is in a way the neglected child of the family. For it is this that makes a bit clearer to us *how* to proceed, what to do and what to not do, in order to come a bit closer to our own "image in mind".
For example, the image "On the edge" was a completely joyfull and happy milestone for me. I was (and still am) very happy with that for the image itself. Say, it is my kind of wish for what to do. I don't want to raise it to some "general rule". It just "looks" right to me because it is in some sense a "macro" but with the wide angle lens. So, much further than being happy for the image itself, I am even more happy for having also recognized at least a tiny bit of "how" to materialize my own idea of photography - again only *if* I can call it my own at all. It was that kind of recognizing that it is not necessarily the macro lens that introduces a certain amount of "macro feel" on some image. (This was the "breaking the rule".) For a professional this is probably so self-evident that it is not even worth talking about, but for me it was a small revelation. I found one possible way (out of theat infinite set of remaing ways outside the "rules") that surely has the potential of generating the consequence (i.e. the kind of image) I had in mind but didn't know how to achieve. If I would stay to treasuring the image and at the same time still "blindly" trying this and that without taking into account the special premises ("macro" with wide angle) that lead to the special results, I would probably not have this perhaps tiny but for me so important cognitive "aha!" It would be perhaps one good image in a series of hundreds if fruitless attampts.
So, we have to keep those moments of luck in a much more conscious way. The first step is the pure joy. I think I am not as mistaken to assume that we all more or less have that. The second step is what I consider to be the one that too few of us appreciate as highly as it should be. It is that moment of a tiny but important understanding of the "revelation". I don't know why it just gets passed by most of the time. Perhapy the understandable unlimited joy overwhelms us so strongly that we forget about anything else? Perhaps. But we really steal ourselves much too much if we only "break the rules" but don't examine "what rule was broken" and where this took us to.
Blabla on a Sunday, you see. ;-)
Cheers!
Nick
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 2/1/2009
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I think the same about Picasso's statement Andre, but to me the underlying implicit set of premises and results is even more important. Because the statement implicitly includes: in order to be able to "paint like a child" (or of course to achieve anything else that one wishes to achieve) one has to spend time with a serious dealing with it. So, for Picasso, as he states himself, it was not to just take the brush and paint like a child, but the exact opposite.
This implicit content was probably not what he wanted to focus on with the statement. Most of the time we automatically take such premises and results under consideration when we talk or think, without really being aware of the consequences. But examine it a bit closer and you find out, that in order to make such a statement one has to priorly accept the importance of serious dedicated dealing with the matter. If this wouldn't be this way, then there would be absolutely no reasons to "hunt behind the dream of painting like a child" so constantly and full of enthusiasm for years and years. In a way... this work doesn not even "feel" like ordinary work. It feels more like doing what you really want to do, and this is also why I use the verb "to deal with" rather than to "work" - though I know that it still doesn't hit the target exactly.
The other thing is that even the avoidance of inhibitions is a rule by itself. You have to know *how* to avoid them and not only *that* you want to avoid them. And this is harder than it sounds for it includes first the recognition of the "unwished rules". (I.e. you can't avoid what you don't recognize as something to avoid.) And second: Even excluding the things that you want to avoid, still an infinit amount of ways remains, ways which you can follow. So, which of them to choose in order to achieve what you want outside the huge but still finite set of rules that produce what you don't want to produce? The mapping of possibilites onto results is not known a-priory. You have to try and see consiously, you have to deal with it.
Certainly also, on the way one will always have the lucky photographical moments, which *of course* have to be grabbed and kept like a treasure. They are good for the produced images and also good for recognizing a bit better what to do and what to avoid. (Holds also for unsuccessful attempts.)
- Second episode about to arrive -
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 1/31/2009
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Hi Nick,
I think when Picasso made that statement, he was probably talking more about being able to get that joyful feeling of accomplishment and freedom without inhibitions that we sometimes loose when we become structured into producing what fits into rules and what is "good", and what is expected of us. I agree with what you say about how you can have a few "lucky accident" images and not have the skill to reprocuce them. Producing "lucky accidents" does not make a person a photographer. However those images can remain powerful documents in some cases.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 1/26/2009
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Well Andre, everybody will take very good images without any priorly accumulated skill, I am also sure about that. We all have taken such images just by having good luck, or a momentary strike of some ingenious idea - one could give it many similar names. The thing is that such a "good luck" (or whatever we name it) is not at all enough for a reproducibility of that "catching the intangibles" on an image. One will have success some few times and failure the rest iof the time. Even those few good images... well, they good perhaps but they are not the consious "translation" of some image in mind into a real image on paper or on file.
Why is this? Well, imagine you see something and it immediately causes that special "something" in yoir mind, and you try to shoot an image of that "something". Now, the possibilities for settings, light consideration, exposure, etc, etc, are endless, and the camera doesn't know what you had in mind. Shooting at good luck you might get a good image, but it will be likely not what you had in mind. It is there where the better mastering of the camera can be used as an orientation toward what you wanted to have.
The statement aboit learning for 80 years in order to be able to paint as a child includes exactly this much more strongly but also much more hidden, and so most of the time it is identified with something like: "Go on and paint without any skills". But it is way not the same! Because that human being says also that it took 80 long years of work in order to do what he wanted to do. You see the difference? It was not "take the brushes and you are already a painter". (Not to speak about the allegoric content of the statement.) So, such statements of most of those brilliant people boil down to the same thing. There are indeed no regulations, or absolute recipes but you have to work hard in order to be able to use the available means in order to get what you want on some image, song, whatever.
The hard thing in all arts is not to be insipred or to have some idea in mind. It is to be able to make that idea visible. Only this separates works of "incident" from works of art. Or else we would come to the absurd situation where even a physically/randomly generated combination of objects could be considered as "art". But this is a contradiction since nothing physical can be art-ificial. ;-)
Nice subject to think about on a Monday morning.
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 1/24/2009
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Very true Nick. But, sometimes when we gain skill, we can over-look the intangibles. A lot of people take amazingly interesting images without training or much effort. (no inhibitions and no expectations) Maybe that's one of the reasons why we all have a few favourite images from the times when we first started. I think it was Picasso that had a quote when he was in his 90's that went something like this. "I've spent the last 80 years of my life learning to paint like when I was a child."
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 1/23/2009
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This is exactly the reason why I keep all images, Andre. Say, a "historical" record of evolving approach to photography. And hopefully also some more skill than yesteryear. ;-)
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 1/22/2009
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Hi Nick,
I know what you mean. It's always good to keep your old stuff so that you can see progress. I have quite a number of old favourites that I wouldn't do any differently today than I did thirty years ago. But, I also have lots of "not so great" stuff that I just can't bring myself to throw out.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 1/18/2009
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(After a long time - continuing now)
The influence of time to me is that the sieve gets finer and finer, Andre. At first I am enthusiastic with many too many shots, then I start finding mist of them just "OK", and then only some few remain in my "favorite list" in mind. When I see now what images I was shooting some years ago... brrrrr, shame and embarassment! ;-)
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 12/28/2008
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Hi Nick,
I find that sometimes we can spend so much time on an image that it becomes un-exciting. Later, after a period of not seeing an image, the original interest comes back.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 12/25/2008
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Indeed, Andre! One of the best detoxification methods ever! ;-)
The images belong to a series that I'll be posting some day in the future. This was one of my best series up there. Almost each second or third shot came out quite well and so I must take some time and detach from it before posting, as I am also still very "sentimentally caught" by the memory, and this means preoccupation too. But still I think that there will be many images that I find OK, even after starting to see them with more neutral eyes.
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 12/20/2008
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The wilderness and open spaces and mountain air has a way of clearing our heads. :)
That is a great attachment Nick. Why not post it just like that?
The individual images seem to be all very good quality too.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 12/15/2008
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I know that, Andre. I was already there with my camera bag many times. For days and days sometimes, and without real "plan" about where I'd go next. I continue doing that, sometimes for me, sometimes for the photos prospects of the local touristic bureaus. Some of those series I'll be posting some day. Small apetizer on the attachment.
Best of all what happens there, when you leave the official paths and just walk somewhere between the mounts, is how the sensitivity is raising in a quiet way. You know exactly what each and every of your slow, careful steps sounds like. You start avoiding to step on some wild plant because all has its value. You don't celebrate then, you rather take notice of the overseen. And at the same time, while walking the hard paths, at some point you stop depending on vanity. So when you come back you speak less and listen more. It is then when I have my best ideas for mathematics too. ;-)
Oh well... cheers!
Nick
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Small appetizer for Andre, another guy "out there" |
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 12/13/2008
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Exactly Nick,
It is why people climb to the top of mountains. Also why people love to venture deeper into the woods. I watched a show a few days ago that had a lot of interviews with the men who landed on the moon. The feeling of being there alone must have been very spiritual. Imagine being there with your camera equipment.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 12/9/2008
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Yes, that's ture, Andre! So such scenes seem to stay "out of special place of time". They are not only international but also "intertemporal". And this always provides some sense of eternity to the place. A mixture of peaceful and "for ever" if you like. Perhaps this turns such images so favorite to most people.
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 12/6/2008
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Thanks Nick,
I agree with what you say about the international appeal of these kinds of scenes. It could be Europe, Asia, North America or any other continent for that matter. Also, what I like about this kind of scene is the timelessness that you don't necessarilly get from a "city" image. I like to imagine that just like your mountain images, this could be any time during the last 50,000 years. My "hunters" could have sticks and stones, bows and arrows or Remington shotguns.
Andre
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 12/4/2008
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Well, there are some timeless things I guess, Andre. One of them must be the many layers of visibility that are generated by a combination of mist, physiology of the terrain, and distance. I don't think that there can be some time when one gets tired with this. Perhaps one shoots such images in a more and more eclectic way as the time passes by, but getting tired of them? I don't think that this can happen to somebody that has the sensitivity for that. It somehow describes distance very naturally according to what one would see "if standing there". I think also that such kind of a mood is very inernational simply because you get it everywhere. It is very close to the own views of such scenes and so it works without limits of countries and lands. When I stand on the balcony on foggy days I see quite the same - only that it is streets and blocks instead of trees and forests that get less and less visible with distance.
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/28/2008
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Thanks Erland,
Glad you like it!
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/28/2008
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That's right Kes,
We aren't happy up here unless we are up to our knees in snow. The snow tires are going on this week. Actually the snow usually doesn't really stay around on the ground in Toronto, until about mid to late December. When you are about 100 miles away from the "lake effect", It's a different story. Our cottage is about 200 miles from Lake Ontario, so, the temps are colder and the snow comes sooner and stays longer. I'm going up this weekend to close up for the winter.
Andre
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Erland Pillegaard
{K:34147} 10/25/2008
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Beautifult picture
erland
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![Nelson Moore [Kes] -](http://images.imageopolis.com/images/5/7/8/7/5787/1481659-micro.jpg)
Nelson Moore [Kes] -
{K:20241} 10/25/2008
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SNOW???
(place loud, long, trailing scream here)
:)
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/25/2008
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Thanks Alicia.
I'm happy that you like it.
Andre
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Alicia Popp
{K:87532} 10/24/2008
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Fantástico ambiente neblinoso, la luz, las plantas... todo con la magia de la niebla, me encanta!
Felicitaciones!!!
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks Kes!
We had a great Thanksgiving! It was beautiful and warm... above average temps.
It snowed a bit yesterday. Not ready for that yet.
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks Rina,
I'm pretty happy with my landscapes lately. Glad you like it!
This will be covered in snow in a few weeks. :(
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks Mojgan,
Glad you like it!
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks Rupert,
I was just writing to Ray that I bet there are a few scenes just like this in the UK this time of year. Your images are a good example.
Thanks for visiting and commenting.
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks very much Ray.
I'm glad you like it. I bet there are a lot of areas in Northern England and Scotland that look similar to this in the early morning. Some of the images that I took that day reminded me of some of those dark old oil paintings that we see with those heavy baroque frames around them.
Thanks again Ray.
Andre
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/23/2008
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Thanks for the great review on this image Nick!
I know the cliche of the layers of mist and trees going into the distance is quite a popular image, but I never get tired of that kind of view myself. I was quite pleased with the "framing effect of the tree on the left too. As you say, it adds some dimension and depth to the image.
It was a lovely morning for this kind of moody shot.
Andre
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Nelson Moore [Kes] -
{K:20241} 10/17/2008
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Nice morning landscape, Andre.
Happy Thanksgiving!
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Caterina Berimballi
{K:27299} 10/17/2008
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Great quote Andre. Love the purity in this image. It just speaks for itself. No need for fancy hdr or pp. It breathes. Nice work.
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Mojgan Bahasadri
{K:16243} 10/17/2008
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Very nice moody landscape.Bravo Andre !!
best to you,
Mojgan
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Rupert Ronca
{K:216} 10/16/2008
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It could be the same morning! I like the detail in the foreground increasing the impact of the misty hills behind.
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stingRay pt.4 .
{K:250401} 10/15/2008
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I love the delicate tones to this delightful landscape my dear Andre. I love too the mistiness which lends an air of mysteriousness to the composition. The foreground tree nicely cropped in on the left provides a kind of scale to the trees spread out below it. A beautiful and simplistic scenario, most pleasing to my eyes. My very best wishes to you as always.....Ray
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Nick Karagiaouroglou
{K:127263} 10/15/2008
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This one has something else on it, Andre! It looks as vague as the very *vision* of a landscape in mind. It is a landscape in the usual sense of course but it also has something unreal much like a projection of the inside to the outside world. I think that the darker appearance has to do with that impression, as well as the many different layer toward the depth of the image, that are visible behind the mist.
The well detailed tree at the left works fine as a marker for the place from where we look at the distance. As a composition I wouldn't change anything here.
A very good example of how uneeded spectacularity can be for a really good image. It is good as a whole and not because of single "top-elements" in it.
Cheers!
Nick
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/15/2008
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Thanks for your support Jim.
I'm glad you like it. I took quite a few yesterday morning, playing around with exposure settings in the morning mist. I like the way this one came out because of it's dark, moody look and subtle details.
Thanks again.
Andre
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Jim Budrakey
{K:24393} 10/14/2008
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What a beautiful scene. Nicely done.
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Andre Denis
{K:66407} 10/14/2008
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Thanks Dave,
I hope you are having a good holiday weekend too.
We had record high temps today in TO. It was a fabulous weekend.
Andre
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Dave Stacey
{K:150877} 10/14/2008
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Nice capture of the rising morning fog, Andre! Just enough light in the sky for this atmospheric scene. Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family, too!
Dave.
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